"Where do you get your protein?"

[Dandelion]

The number one question i get asked!
Ah where shall i start...
So who wants to take this one first?

[Spaceman]

Protein in a vegan diet shows that you can have a variety of foods through out the day and still get the amount of protein you would need.

I have also heard of some vegan protein bars. Has anyone ever tried them or would recommend a certain brand?

[Vegit-8]

Oh boy, I love this one.
Bottom line is that if you are getting enough calories while eating a diverse diet of whole foods you are getting all the protein you need for good health.
One of the reasons people overestimate the amount of protein needed in the human diet is that most of our protein comes from heated sourses. The heating of protein causes the protein molecules to become more complicated through various processes including something called cross-linkage which makes it more difficult for our systems to digest and get at the needed amino acids and short chain amino peptide groups. The result is people end up sometimes needing to eat much more protein in order to get enough usable protein from such foods. The stronger a persons digestion (less exhausted) the better there return on protein consumed.
The difficulty usually lies in consuming a diet made up predominantly of processed ( read: denatured) foods and with a diet restricted to only a few different foods.
example:cake, bread, scones, pasta, crackers,- almost all wheat so no variety in base nutrients other than some of these wheat foods/forms are more denatured than others.
As a vegan it is easy and practical to get all the protein (amino acids) needed for good health.
My favorite vegan protein food for people who feel they need extra and want to use a booster of some sort is Hemp Protein by Ancient Harvest. This is a complete protein sourse that is produced without heat or chemicals so all the nutrients are intact/undamaged, including enzymes. It is available in Canada in health food stores and some vitamin stores.
Other good sourses of amino acids include spirulina, bean sprouts, sprouted grains, some nuts, most seeds......
Keep in mind that our desire should be for attaining/maintaining good health overall, not just looking for specific nutrients and building blocks. When we follow a diet made up of a majority of healthy, natural, whole foods and which embraces variety then we are unlikely to find ourselves lacking for protein or any other nutrients.

Peace and joy and vibrant health be with you.

[VeganKen]

To one person who asked me this question I responded by asking him where he thought cows got their protein from. Large herbivores are obviously not lacking in protein. Once he made the connection he started asking me more questions and seemed sincerely interested.

[herbi]

I like that question ("where do you think (x) gets their protein?") and have used it myself-- non-threatening, good for the laypeson. But be careful who you ask! I wouldn't use it on someone simultaneously argumentative and well-versed in bovine biology (not that I know anyone like that... ) -- cattle (and many other large herbivores) are ruminants, and get a lot of help from bacterial fermentation when assembling their proteins... not exactly something us vegans are capable of last time I checked!

[VeganKen]

Originally posted by herbi
I wouldn't use it on someone simultaneously argumentative and well-versed in bovine biology (not that I know anyone like that... )

Point taken! I happen to work with biologists and they seem to accept this statement. Although try calling a spider a 'bug' and you're in for a two hour lecture...

[karabear]

any vegetable that has not been processed contains enough protein to sustain a human being. even if you lived exclusively on broccoli, you would still be getting more protein than is recommended by the government.

[herbi]

Originally posted by karabear
even if you lived exclusively on broccoli,

Whoah! Let's not go too crazy! I am 100% on board with the idea that "getting protein" is simply not an issue (and I love broccoli), but let's not give "Them" an opening, huh? It's not necessary to keep meticulous track of it as some would have you believe, but you DO need to get ALL the essential amino acids, and I do not believe that broccoli qualifies as a complete source... Variation is the key!

[penfold]

yeah - even a meat eater who only ate broccolli might have protein issues

[mudy]

"a meat eater who only ate broccolli"

i must be really tired..

[karabear]

if i hear any more about this "complete protein" stuff, i'm going to crack! to prove once and for all that it is a myth, i've compiled a little actual data (as opposed to the oh-so-common *conjectures* that we hear regarding this subject).

the first number is the data for the amount of the amino acid in broccoli and the second is the amount in a t-bone steak...

raw broccoli vs. t-bone steak
(grams per 100 calories)

histidine: 0.39 vs. 0.31
isoleucine: 0.47 vs. 0.55
leucine: 0.50 vs. 0.57
lysine: 0.12 vs. 0.18
methionine: 0.30 vs. 0.27
phenylalanine: 0.33 vs. 0.30
threonine: 0.10 vs. 0.08
tryptophan: 0.23 vs. 0.23
tyrosine: 0.46 vs. 0.34
valine: 0.42 vs. 0.42

the broccoli and steak have comparable amounts of all the essential amino acids. in fact, broccoli even beats steak in a couple of categories! so can we stop worrying about this silly "complete protein" myth, please?

[iamtheqbu]

Ohh! I love that data! Where did you get it exactly? I'd love to send that to some of my meat-head buddies!

[karabear]

this is the same food composition data that i was talking about in the b12 thread. it's really great because most of the data you see out there that says meat is more nutrient rich is based upon weight (grams nutrient per 100 grams of food). if you do your calculations like that, then meat usually wins. but last time i checked, the recommendation was to eat around 2000 calories a day, not such-and-such grams or pounds of food a day. so anyway, this chart also has nutrient composition based on calories (grams nutrient per 100 calories of food). then the veggies almost always win. (yay veggies!)

i recommend anybody who is reading stuff talking about veggies not having enough of this or that, take a look at the real data before believing it. most of the "science" i've seen out there is completely inaccurate (even the stuff that veg*an organizations are telling people)...

[penfold]

i don't have much truck (what is that anyway?) with protein combining and the intrinsic incompleteness of vegetable foods, but if your numbers are correct, you'd need to eat around 80 cups of broccolli a day to get your 2000 calories. and you still might not be above the recommended amount of protein.

i don't believe all the science i hear either. in fact, i don't beleive any of it

[karabear]

hey, i didn't say you would *want* to live exclusively off of broccoli! i just said technically, in terms of protein, you could. i certainly don't think that you should because you would certainly be missing out on other nutrients (not to mention becoming terribly bored of broccoli).

human plant-based diets have been around since humans first evolved. (i don't mean exclusively plant diets, but plant-*based* ones, so don't go ranting about that!) it is the heavily meat-laden diets of modern times that are truly the new fad. so why is it that we worry over our diets so much? because the meat and dairy industries spend millions and millions of dollars flooding the media with false-science about how dangerous plant-based diets are. every time i see one of these message boards talking about nutrition i cringe because i see that those millions of dollars have paid off. if veg*ans go out and read the real science that's easily available through online scientific journals instead of going "oh i heard this rumor here and this over there," then we won't need to have ridiculous conversations about protein!

i'm sorry, but i've spent almost half my life defending my dietary choices. probably most, if not all of, the rest of you spend a good deal of time doing the same thing. i have researched diet *extensively*. i don't want to have to argue the same points with fellow veg*ans as i do with omnivores. stop nit-picking.

p.s. 2000 calories worth of broccoli gives you 192 grams of protein, all in the same "completeness" that you would get from eating 192 grams of protein from a steak. is 192 grams of protein enough for you, or are you going to start complaining that it's too much protein?